tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post3414423432874310510..comments2024-03-18T20:22:06.331-04:00Comments on GROGNARDIA: REVIEW: Dungeons & Dragons Starter SetJames Maliszewskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comBlogger58125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-12385552251859466802011-03-15T16:36:09.536-04:002011-03-15T16:36:09.536-04:00Just bought this over the weekend for my son who t...Just bought this over the weekend for my son who turned 12. Personally, it did 'feel' good seeing the old box of what I remembered getting 26 odd years ago. I still have my old books and it was fun to see not only my son get into it, but my 14 yo daughter excited to create her back-story (which of course has plenty of drama - and a romantic theme). My wife laughs at how giddy I am to do this again, and I thought this Starter Kit was a great find.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05040045828065980926noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-43296872628354587442010-09-14T10:36:31.527-04:002010-09-14T10:36:31.527-04:00My empathy tells me that Mike Mearls is, by all ev...My empathy tells me that Mike Mearls is, by all evidence I've seen, a talented and stand-up guy, and it's cool that he's acknowledging possible mistakes and trying to make things right.<br /><br />My <i>schadenfreude</i>, which is more keenly developed than my empathy, tells me LOL.Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00155926145150934199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-67255603864293042602010-09-14T10:33:15.741-04:002010-09-14T10:33:15.741-04:00Hey folks, I actually just did an interview with M...Hey folks, I actually just did an interview with Mike Mearls on The Escapist, that's all about the red box.<br /><br />http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_271/8109-Red-Box-Renaissance<br /><br />It's an interesting interview. Essentials, according to Mearls, actually is the new direction for the game. He even told us not to buy the old books. He thinks the game went wrong in 4e and is trying to steer it right.<br /><br />Example quote: "If you look at the Fighter and the way he works in D&D Essentials, we removed the Daily powers to get more of a sense that 'fighters and wizards should look really different,' because that's how D&D originally approached it," Mearls said.Restitutor Orbishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05625086532637410710noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-24588929749084614742010-09-14T04:33:08.355-04:002010-09-14T04:33:08.355-04:003E is the clear heir to AD&D. 4E is deliberat...3E is the clear heir to AD&D. 4E is deliberately cut down and simplified, with the DM given much more control and freedom. I found DMing 3E a lot of work, and now find DMing 4E a relative breeze. 4E is a somewhat ambitious attempt to fix some longstanding issues with D&D while paring back the weight and depth of rules it had accumulated. I know that sounds ironic, given the sheer page count, but the actual rules (as opposed to character options; powers and feats) are MUCH shorter and simpler than 3E or AD&D, for that matter.<br /> <br />Jeff Rients still has the Mike Mearls quote on his page: "Yup, that's right. At WotC we're playing OD&D. I read Jeff Rients' report of his Winter War OD&D game, and I had to run the game."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-72892669101964838732010-09-13T19:52:58.256-04:002010-09-13T19:52:58.256-04:00Mind you, I am not saying 4th Edition even vaguely...<i>Mind you, I am not saying 4th Edition even vaguely resembles those sets mechanically—it is the love child of 3.0 and 3.5—but it is clear that 4e was created by people with nostalgic feelings for the old boxes.</i><br /><br>This is a very intriguing comment. I hadn't considered this possibility.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-90092644233158720762010-09-13T19:49:07.487-04:002010-09-13T19:49:07.487-04:00I think James, that the Elmore art and revived “re...I think James, that the Elmore art and revived “red box” format have thrown you for a loop only because you have paid little attention to 4th Edition. Having never been an AD&D fan—I started with the Holmes boxed set and followed all the boxed set lines through Mentzer—I was completely put off by 3rd Edition, which was “D&D” in name only. In every way that really mattered (races, classes, Great Wheel Cosmology, alignment, and edition designation) it was Advanced Dungeons & Dragons with a jumped up system and the “A” filed off. 4th Edition—which I tried but did not like—was clearly revised by people like me who had fonder memories of the Mentzer “classic D&D” than OD&D or AD&D. It scaled down the alignment system to something closer to the boxed sets, dumped the Great Wheel cosmology in favor of something that looked suspiciously like the classic universe, and revived the concept of tiered play which characterized the boxed sets. The initial classes and races (aside from the silly new additions) even dumped AD&D touches like Barbarians, Druids, and Gnomes. Heck, the 4e monster manual did not even have AD&D’s metallic dragons, just as the boxed sets didn’t. Mind you, I am not saying 4th Edition even vaguely resembles those sets mechanically—it is the love child of 3.0 and 3.5—but it is clear that 4e was created by people with nostalgic feelings for the old boxes. This “Starter Set” merely confirms what I have felt about 4e since it appeared.Andrew Logan Montgomeryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16862829026060203177noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-14401117245693327392010-09-13T17:43:14.370-04:002010-09-13T17:43:14.370-04:00"I completely disagree. In 3rd ed., the DM co..."I completely disagree. In 3rd ed., the DM could never be a master. The players always had special rules or spells that could get them out of any jam. Additionally, the rules were so specific that the DM really didn't have any leeway to dictate how things happened. 4e gives the DM much more control over narration and scene control."<br /><br />I'm actually on the side of 3e, here, which was actually something of a pseudo-simulationist algorithm which seemed to lend itself to on-the-fly adjustments - and was incredibly easy to "weight" while remaining 5% or so unpredictable. As soon as you've got "Encounter Powers," for example, though, you have to start designating "Encounters," which actually starts mucking about with the pace of a game. 3.0 started the mess with the miniature's handbook (with its unabstractable "positioning"), but you could ignore that and play the game. You can whittle that part out of 3.5 (basically by updating some bits of 3.0) or Pathfinder. 4e seems to have written the aspects so deeply into the game, and added more besides, that I for one CAN'T play the thing without a Grid and set-piece "encounters," at least without rendering a large part of Chargen meaningless and stipping pcs of their abilties.<br /><br />P.S.: I got the new box for $15. It's now the new home for my Mentzer books (take out the slanted cardbord, and they'll fit!) and a set of Modlvay/Cook. If I ever feel compelled to use minis for a special combat or anything, the floorplans and chits might come in handy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-72037695870635281592010-09-13T17:01:45.533-04:002010-09-13T17:01:45.533-04:00"It's as if you were playing good old bas...<i>"It's as if you were playing good old basic D&D, except that instead of all hits dealing 1d6 damage, all hits are supposed to deal 1 (or, if you're casting a spell, 2-3) points of damage."</i><br /><br />You're half right. What you're missing is this: Some classes are much better at dealing damage than others. For example, a first level rogue can deal 1d4+5+2d6 damage with a basic attack, not even using an at will power. A dwarf fighter can do 3d10+7 with a daily at level 1. <br /><br />Encounter powers do a lot of damage, and they're not used occasionally, as you suggest. No, by 9th level, each character generally has 4 or so encounter powers, and so they're coming out every round. Not to mention the synergy bonuses that characters can get by working together. For example, the Warlord in our group can expend his at-will to allow an ally to take a second attack with a +5 bonus to damage. Groups that work as a team are very dangerous.<br /><br />Still... there is a big grind factor, especially with new DMs, who often stick lots of "soldier" and "brute" monsters in a single encounter. It's an issue that's been discussed quite a bit on some of the 4e forums.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-15804518904724214192010-09-13T15:03:53.043-04:002010-09-13T15:03:53.043-04:00Rach's reflections, do you know if the next pr...<b>Rach's reflections</b>, do you know if the next print run will include the changes seen in the Essentials line? My understanding was that they just weren't going to bother reprinting the older rules when they had the compendium out.<br /><br />If they do, then that might be a problem. As <b>bt</b> says, how does a shopper know what to buy if they see the starter set, the Red Box, the Essentials and the original books, all in a row?thekelvingreenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01928260185408072124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-46835450156119481222010-09-13T15:03:37.665-04:002010-09-13T15:03:37.665-04:00Here’s my take on the confusion aspect:
I already...Here’s my take on the confusion aspect:<br /><br />I already have a visual guide to D&D editions that I have to break out when talking about D&D to someone in any depth. It’s already confusing enough to try to come up with names for all the games that have been called “D&D”. At least the covers helped. Now, even there you suddenly need a footnote or qualification.<br /><br />Or look at the “red box” groups that are springing up. It used to be that you could put a picture of the old red box on a flyer and people would either know what the group was about or at least know that it was about an edition they weren’t familiar with. That’s no longer true.<br /><br />It’s not a big issue, IMHO, but it is senseless.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-39673157817767455092010-09-13T14:55:45.986-04:002010-09-13T14:55:45.986-04:00I bought this product purely so that I could get m...I bought this product purely so that I could get my hands on the shiny retro box, to keep my actual Mentzer booklets in. On that count, I'm not disappointed. It's a really nice box.<br /><br />What comes inside the box, though, is another matter entirely. I was already passingly familiar with the 4th edition (A)D&D rules, but this is the first time I've really examined them in-depth, and one thing struck me above all else: LOOK AT HOW MANY HIT POINTS THE MONSTERS HAVE.<br /><br />Weapon damage isn't all that inflated compared to previous editions. The "basic attack" deals a die of damage plus a middling single-digit modifier, not all that far off from typical weapon damage in a 3rd edition game. But hit points have increased tenfold! Gelatinous cube with 150 hp? Kobolds with 30 hp? When in all the older versions, it wouldn't be unusual to see 15 and 3 for the respective monster's hp totals? NO WONDER PEOPLE COMPLAIN ABOUT THE "GRIND"!<br /><br />This sticks in my craw, because it means that the vaunted, carefully balanced math that went into designing 4th edition is actually a carefully concealed shell-game meant to hide the fact that combat is a huge time-sink, pretty much by design. <br /><br />Does everybody remember how in the *real* Mentzer basic set, the first example battle was your solo adventure fighter versus a snake, and you just exchanged blows that dealt 1 hp of damage (since the game was explaining the concept of hit points, but hadn't gotten around to rolling damage yet)? That's what *all* combat in 4th edition is *supposed* to be like, spiced up on occasion with encounter and daily powers. It's as if you were playing good old basic D&D, except that instead of all hits dealing 1d6 damage, all hits are supposed to deal 1 (or, if you're casting a spell, 2-3) points of damage. Think about how long combat would take in OD&D if that were the case, and you have a good idea of how 4th edition is *intended* to play.<br /><br />The options in the Starter Set player's book, too, seem carefully geared to pushing players toward engaging in combat. Try to select an option that doesn't meet 4e's definition of "heroic" (i.e. violence motivated by lawful goodness) and the booklet tells you go back and pick a more appropriately bloodthirsty-but-not-evil course of action. Oy gevalt!<br /><br />D&D is supposed be a role-playing game, not a skirmish sim.John Higginshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06522143715905888511noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-59541778820928816752010-09-13T14:10:01.377-04:002010-09-13T14:10:01.377-04:00"Like someone else commented, in 4e, the GM c...<i>"Like someone else commented, in 4e, the GM can never be a master."</i><br /><br />I completely disagree. In 3rd ed., the DM could never be a master. The players always had special rules or spells that could get them out of any jam. Additionally, the rules were so specific that the DM really didn't have any leeway to dictate how things happened. 4e gives the DM much more control over narration and scene control.<br /><br />Where 4e takes away some DM control is in how you move monsters around the battlefield. Players have lots of powers that push/pull/immobilize creatures. I know DMs who hate that mechanic, because they can't just say "the boss walks up to the wizard and pounds him." No, instead, the boss might be dazed or immobilized, and the DM actually has to use some tactics and skill to challenge the players.<br /><br />Overall, I think 4e appeals to wargamers. The wargames crowd already expects complexity, and they're willing to accept that in a game that plays cleanly and provides a tactical challenge. That's a fair description of 4e. <br /><br />If WotC feels that targeting the wargamer market is a wise business move, that's their right. In their defense, it's been 3 years since 4e was released, and a lot of people are still playing it, so it seems they're doing something right.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-71714820431553411392010-09-13T13:47:39.888-04:002010-09-13T13:47:39.888-04:00I succumbed to the marketing blitz at Gen Con and ...I succumbed to the marketing blitz at Gen Con and PAX, and ordered the starter box from Amazon.<br /><br />I guess I qualify as one of the "lapsed gamers" described above. I used to play a lot when I was a teenager (1st Edition), and am now a middle-aged salaryman who's getting back to the table and would love to play more than I do. <br /><br />All of my D&D-playing friends play 4E, and I enjoyed it when I tried it - except that I'm finding it really complicated. I spent much of the game sessions flipping through the rulebook trying to figure out the rules for flanking and combat advantage, and managing all of my powers and healing surges and whatnot.<br /><br />Now, I managed to figure out Champions back in the day, so I think I could figure out 4E eventually. But I was an obsessive 14-year-old kid with lots of unsupervised time on his hands back then. My hope for the new red box is that it will provide training wheels to help ease me into the 4E rules. And the red box reassures me with the promise that I will feel as comfortable and familiar with this game as I did in the early 1980s.<br /><br />But I haven't played it yet, so...we'll see.Wade Rocketthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02785499425476736769noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-47831422692606467952010-09-13T13:34:55.112-04:002010-09-13T13:34:55.112-04:00It never ceases to amaze me how two of the industr...It never ceases to amaze me how two of the industries which meant so much to me as a kid (RPG and comics) can be so relentless in their efforts to confuse the (potential) market and extract as much money as possible from a shrinking audience. If someone were going to walk in off the street and try to "start" playing D&D, they'd be confronted with a series of high-priced hardcovers (some of them bearing the word "essential" in their title, which sure makes it seem like as if you need to purchase them in order to play the game), a new red-boxed "starter" set whose trade dress looks nothing like the other books, an older "starter" set which *does* look like the other books, *plus* a "compendium" of the rules, all of which bear some unspecified relationship to each other. Where to begin? And if you're the unlucky guy who elected to start with the "starter" set, you quickly find out that in order to play the game in any meaningful sense, you should have just put your $20 towards the aforementioned high-priced hardcovers. If the industry was *intentionally* trying to alienate potential new players it's hard to imagine what else they could do to accomplish that goal short of publishing everything in Sanskrit.<br /><br />It's the same affliction which has meant that a decade of Spider-Man (and other comic book) movies (which, measured in dollars are among the most successful movies in history) has translated into no appreciable increase in sales of the underlying property: the budding Spider-Man reader walks into a store and is confronted with, depending on the year and month, upwards of a half-dozen ongoing monthly titles spanning multiple fictional universes, to say nothing of one-shots, limited series and cross-overs. Both industries seem intent on wringing the last available dollar from every remaining fan - and seem to confuse what will appeal to existing customers with what will appeal to new ones.bthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01126184371926546497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-22989459503221232132010-09-13T13:19:30.088-04:002010-09-13T13:19:30.088-04:00I noted that for the D&D Game Day last Saturda...<i>I noted that for the D&D Game Day last Saturday, WotC was suggesting that players come enjoy a retro gaming experience.</i><br /><br>In recent months, I've seen a lot of products making use of 70s and 80s nostalgia as a marketing ploy (which is interesting in itself), so I guess WotC is just tapping into that? Sadly, it's all form and no substance and simply calling something "retro" and slapping old art on the box isn't enough to change its essential nature (pun intended).James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-27824341523678828252010-09-13T13:16:48.602-04:002010-09-13T13:16:48.602-04:00As I’ve said before, Wizards taught me what I want...<i>As I’ve said before, Wizards taught me what I want by giving me exactly what I thought I wanted.</i><br /><br>Too true! It took me a little longer to realize my folly than it ought to have, but, you're right, WotC did do me a service in the end.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-54009379990959645552010-09-13T13:12:02.911-04:002010-09-13T13:12:02.911-04:00I noted that for the D&D Game Day last Saturda...I noted that for the D&D Game Day last Saturday, WotC was suggesting that players come enjoy a retro gaming experience.pookiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09521454715536568847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-18319747809229580692010-09-13T12:44:04.441-04:002010-09-13T12:44:04.441-04:00I am not sure how I see the confusion part.
The t...I am not sure how I see the confusion part.<br /><br />The target audience for this set are people that have not gamed in decades or have gamed at all. With the last group they have no prior experiences to confuse them with.<br /><br />Personally I think that anyone that reads this blog is by definition far outside of the target market. Not the WotC is trying to exclude us, but they are going where the potential for new customers is. We have games, often several that are called "D&D", we don't need this intro.<br /><br />All that aside I do applaud their efforts.<br />They are going after a new crowd and they are pricing the game at a level to attract the most casual of buyer. The retro-design sure has it's appeal, but again we are not who they are aiming for.<br /><br />Having played the game I can say it is fun. It is easy to learn and I had my kids up and running with it in no time. At the end of the day, that is what I want in a game.<br /><br />It's like that old parody commercial for the Wii vs. Playtstation 3. Play the Wii, it is cheap and fun. <br /><br />Now if we could only see a D&D Classics line. Hasbro is already doing it with the Star Wars figures. Of course splitting an already small market is rarely a good idea.Timothy S. Brannanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02923526503305233715noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-70222874896425088582010-09-13T12:33:47.061-04:002010-09-13T12:33:47.061-04:00"Like someone else commented, in 4e, the GM c..."Like someone else commented, in 4e, the GM can never be a master. There's no way I can keep track of all the hyperspecial attacks..."Flying Crotchgrab Smash" doesn't really give a hint" <br /><br />Yup. GMing 4e I definitely don't feel that I am in charge. Sometimes it's nice to be surprised, but other times I just feel bewildered and a bit lost. GMing OSRIC online recently I've really loved the feel of actually being in charge of the game again, of it being my rulings, not the book's rules, that the game hangs on. It's a big responsibility to do it right, but I think it makes for a better and more satisfying game for everyone.Simonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01173759805310975320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-62317505439982685052010-09-13T12:33:12.345-04:002010-09-13T12:33:12.345-04:00They are whoring the old school aesthetic to sell ...They are whoring the old school aesthetic to sell the product and, in the process, it will confuse customers. The whole thing is a sham/e.Kiltedyaksmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03462341093016199620noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-73833301834237918472010-09-13T12:07:07.316-04:002010-09-13T12:07:07.316-04:00James, you should thank Wizards for sending you on...James, you should <i>thank</i> Wizards for sending you on this journey rather than <i>blaming</i> them. ^_^<br /><br />As I’ve said before, Wizards taught me what I want by giving me exactly what I <i>thought</i> I wanted. Would I have ever found Dragonsfoot and rediscovered classic D&D without 3e?<br /><br />Anyway, this review is disappointing. While I’m not a fan of 4e, I thought perhaps Wizards had finally seen the light with respect to an introductory game, but it seems they’ve made the same mistakes.<br /><br />The brand name with the most potential to expand the hobby and the market, and they’re squandering it with an overly complex system that turns off many newcomers. It doesn’t help to have a simple “starter set” if you then dump them straight into full 4e.<br /><br />Time to sprinkle a few more print-outs of retro-clones and quick-starts thereof around the world.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16733274876782876659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-84631467514727702192010-09-13T11:56:01.549-04:002010-09-13T11:56:01.549-04:00With the advent of Essentials, my group finally ga...With the advent of Essentials, my group finally gave up on the great 4e experiment, after over a year of gamely trying to get the rules to work.<br /><br />We went back to AD&D (pre-2nd edition), starting with Keep on the Borderlands. Granted, we miss a few innovations like skills, but still the game is just so much more fun. "I attack" is plenty when even ogres don't have 20 hit points, and it was so nice as DM to actually be master of the game. We'll probably phase in a few 2nd edition things soon.<br /><br />Like someone else commented, in 4e, the GM can never be a master. There's no way I can keep track of all the hyperspecial attacks..."Flying Crotchgrab Smash" doesn't really give a hint, and the hundreds of hit points of healing and damage sloshing around just doesn't make for a clean game even if the GM could really follow it all.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-2865831968516844632010-09-13T11:33:52.820-04:002010-09-13T11:33:52.820-04:00@Spawn of Endra: "(I don't even know if t...@Spawn of Endra: "(I don't even know if they still use Player's Handbooks anymore, that's how Old School I am.)"<br /><br />Ha. Having observed that PHB's sell better than other products, they now have an entire PHB product line for 4E (i.e., PHB1, PHB2, and PHB3).<br /><br />@JRT: Great link.Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-61830451041954345392010-09-13T10:35:31.811-04:002010-09-13T10:35:31.811-04:00It's to get people who lapsed during the Mentz...<i>It's to get people who lapsed during the Mentzer days for one reason or another and see the box while they're at Target (They sell it at Target, now. How the hell about that, James?) Christmas shopping for their little cousins or whatever and be like "oh hey, D&D!"</i><br /><br>You may well be right, but experiences teaches me that, while this sort of strategy does result in short term sales, it does not translate into creating new players of the game. Back during the 3e days, I bought its version of a starter set for my younger cousins and they were simply baffled and disinterested in the thing. Now, maybe if I'd actually played it with them, they might have become hooked, I don't know.<br /><br />Remember I was and am a very devoted roleplaying gamer. How many lapsed Mentzer era players, though, will be devoted enough to play the game with their little relatives, especially when its contents are <i>nothing</i> like the game they played back in the 80s? I'd be amazed if it were many.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-61526761605503222252010-09-13T10:32:08.903-04:002010-09-13T10:32:08.903-04:00I was hoping you'd post a review of this. I&#...I was hoping you'd post a review of this. I'd like to share my thoughts, as a 36 year old father of two boys, 9 and 15. As a kid, I had all the Mentzer era D&D boxed sets and dabbled in 2E for several years as well, before abandoning D&D for other things. I picked the new box up thinking it would be a great family activity, and good math practice for my 9 year old.<br /><br />I ran through the character creation with both kids. My younger son loved it, and went into great detail RPing the fights. My oldest was more into the rules aspects and number crunching. That's all well and good, it takes both to make the world go around, right?<br /><br />I made a character for my wife and we all sat down one evening and ran through the first group encounter from the DM's book. It took over an hour to run this single encounter. My oldest son had questions about the skill Sneak Attack, which the Player's book instructed to write down as a skill but had no corresponding power card. We just ignored it after a fruitless, lengthy search through both books. They are horribly organized for any sort of reference. After the encounter was over, we quit for the evening.<br /><br />I am of the opinion that there is far too much rules-mongering in this new edition. I like the idea of power cards, but it makes things so slow when each character can use so many special abilities! I thought I'd simply slog through it until we got through the DM book adventures at least. <br /><br />But then I read about the encounter with the white dragon. To see an interaction with such a beast reduced to "make X skill checks in a row to win" broke my heart. That kind of an encounter should be role played, not roll played through! I put the book down in disgust.<br /><br />The next time I was at my local game shop, in the used game section, was a battered copy of the Mentzer Basic rulebooks. I bought both for $6 total and plan to use the nice red box I have to store them in. Might pick up some old 1E AD&D stuff for kicks soon, and I suspect they'll make more memories for us than the new edition ever would have.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09264261934018843347noreply@blogger.com