tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post4465414627506728996..comments2024-03-28T01:53:34.870-04:00Comments on GROGNARDIA: Dwarven VariationJames Maliszewskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comBlogger34125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-52444186933913242302011-07-16T14:24:10.485-04:002011-07-16T14:24:10.485-04:00That's a brilliant take, suburbanbanshee. Nic...That's a brilliant take, suburbanbanshee. Nice insight.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-25989570758618682052011-07-14T05:42:10.128-04:002011-07-14T05:42:10.128-04:00Much love for the Rankin-Bass version. Excellent ...Much love for the Rankin-Bass version. Excellent sound design and voice acting.JDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07468586709952502011noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-32594931565068698512011-07-14T00:22:28.462-04:002011-07-14T00:22:28.462-04:00The only good thing about the animated movie, to m...The only good thing about the animated movie, to me, was John Huston's voice.<br /><br />The dwarves were too silly and goofy-looking. The dwarves in the book were serious people.Revenanthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11374515200055384226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-83199520288797074692011-07-13T20:29:53.785-04:002011-07-13T20:29:53.785-04:00Forgot something else...
The dwarves aren't r...Forgot something else...<br /><br />The dwarves aren't really cowards, or greedy monsters. They're people who were raised in an advanced civilization, forced to run for their lives as teenagers across hundreds of miles, who then did coalmining for a living as the poor relatives. They work their way up to being businessmen instead of blue collar. Then in middle age, they finally get a chance to get their own back, in both senses. To avoid their fear, they proceed to treat it like just another a business trip instead of a death-or-glory mission. Then the realities of the situation repeatedly hit them, and they react almost totally from gut emotion. As most people would.<br /><br />They're just these guys, you know? Miners and traders, people with jobs. They're not adventurers, any more than Bilbo is; their heroic sides are buried in exactly the same way.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-25584849136582967552011-07-13T19:55:08.791-04:002011-07-13T19:55:08.791-04:00What accent? (And for the record, animated Smaug s...What accent? (And for the record, animated Smaug scared the crud out of me.)<br /><br />Well, with any luck, most of the extra run time will be fanfic about the stuff in the background with the Necromancer gathering his forces and then running off to Mordor, or possibly The Flashback Adventures of Belladonna Took, Hobbit Ninja!, or Tauriel the Orc/Vampire Slayer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-65389012078303198022011-07-13T16:54:31.623-04:002011-07-13T16:54:31.623-04:00(To be honest, on viewing the scene again, he come...(To be honest, on viewing the scene again, he comes across as pretty thick.)Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07090296806321882601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-86217459357952941062011-07-13T16:50:52.706-04:002011-07-13T16:50:52.706-04:00Since Peter Jackson is apparently making 2 movies ...Since Peter Jackson is apparently making 2 movies out of the Hobbit, I suspect at least some of the Dwarves are going to have backstories/subplots in order to fill out the running time. I mean, that's probably four hours of cinema to tell a story I thought could be done comfortably in 90 minutes.<br /><br /> At this point, I'm wondering if these films are going to suffer from "King Kong"-style adaptation bloat, with the story getting lost amidst character pieces.lawwolfehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16664248936187738562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-76093593202441652522011-07-13T16:48:10.489-04:002011-07-13T16:48:10.489-04:00Smaug is a monster, but he's an intelligent an...Smaug is a monster, but he's an intelligent and cunning monster. Richard Boone's Smaug never seemed like he was a danger just to converse with. Plus, I can't buy that accent.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07090296806321882601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-55218315423489217182011-07-13T16:29:33.374-04:002011-07-13T16:29:33.374-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.lawwolfehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16664248936187738562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-70815597512678080112011-07-13T15:43:28.605-04:002011-07-13T15:43:28.605-04:00"but there are still enough changes and omiss..."but there are still enough changes and omissions to the story that I find it hard to wholeheartedly endorse it. I'm petty that way."<br /><br />Not petty at all. I wholeheartedly admit my fondness for this movie is based on my childhood encounter with it. The changes are significant and frustrating and I felt it even at the time.<br /><br />As to John not liking Richard Boone's characterization, I like its "crudeness". To me Smaug is a murderous horror and any effort to polish that up with fine talk shouldn't hide that. I couldn't buy it if he sounded like James Mason.The Wasphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08636805818054637966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-37616809393870440752011-07-13T15:36:24.456-04:002011-07-13T15:36:24.456-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.The Wasphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08636805818054637966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-35403861364292273772011-07-13T15:20:50.757-04:002011-07-13T15:20:50.757-04:00For my money, David Wenzel did it best: http://www...For my money, David Wenzel did it best: http://www.davidwenzel.com/hobbit.html#Matthew Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04905727799828366356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-73131946402955869592011-07-13T13:47:36.790-04:002011-07-13T13:47:36.790-04:00For all the flaws in character race design (the wo...<i>For all the flaws in character race design (the wood elves hurt my brain), the look of the clothing so much better captures the ancient Germanic (Gothic/Frankish/Saxon, etc.) vibe I get from the books than do the designs of Peter Jackson.</i><br /><br>Very true. Middle-earth is a very Northern European kind of place, at least the parts of it that are important to the two novels. I would prefer it if the character and costume design reflected that.<br /><br /><i>Note - I actually love that Rankin and Bass' dwarves come in matched sets. It's the feeling I always got from their names in the first place.</i><br /><br>As I said, the Rankin/Bass cartoon is flawed in many ways, but I think it did a decent job with the dwarves. They hew pretty closely to what Tolkien wrote and they make the characters as distinct as is necessary for the plot (which isn't very distinct in some cases, admittedly).James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-16417154414377645802011-07-13T13:44:40.647-04:002011-07-13T13:44:40.647-04:00he's actually giving each dwarf a well fleshed...<i>he's actually giving each dwarf a well fleshed-out back story.</i><br /><br>Which is absurd on numerous levels.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-72060614522514183472011-07-13T13:44:01.002-04:002011-07-13T13:44:01.002-04:00In many ways it captured the spirit of the book mo...<i>In many ways it captured the spirit of the book more than Jackson's LotR did.</i><br /><br>Oh, I agree with this point very much, but there are still enough changes and omissions to the story that I find it hard to wholeheartedly endorse it. I'm petty that way.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-32980666283270357362011-07-13T13:42:24.069-04:002011-07-13T13:42:24.069-04:00Pshaw! At least they had songs. Jackson had only o...<i>Pshaw! At least they had songs. Jackson had only one per movie!</i><br /><br>True!James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-73589187327814419402011-07-13T13:42:00.015-04:002011-07-13T13:42:00.015-04:00But how really important is it to be able to disti...<i>But how really important is it to be able to distinguish one dwarf from any other in The Hobbit anyway?</i><br /><br>Not very, in my opinion, since Tolkien himself painted most of them with very broad strokes. Only a handful have distinctive enough personalities to warrant worrying about making them all look distinct.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-28761331645862442802011-07-13T11:08:23.701-04:002011-07-13T11:08:23.701-04:00Tolkien based his dwarves on medieval stereotypes ...Tolkien based his dwarves on medieval stereotypes of Jews mixed with mythical Norse dwarfs. I don't know about Welsh miners.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07090296806321882601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-36202164174278819082011-07-13T10:56:27.367-04:002011-07-13T10:56:27.367-04:00I like this better than the over the top Jackson a...I like this better than the over the top Jackson adaptation or the Backshi cartoon. Everyone seems to forget that Tolkien has probably based his dwarves on the Welsh miners. I enjoyed reading The Hobbit. Actually forced myself to read the whole of the Lord Of The Rings, where World War One overshadows any spirit of fantasy. The WORST part of the Jackson film adaptation was the computer animation of the massive battle scenes. It was so obviously computer generated, made me appreciate the mass choreography of the battle scenes of the Alexander Nevsky. Computer aided graphics also killed the Star Wars pre-cuels for me. Empire Strikes Back was the best of the original three for me. Looking forward to The Hobbit. Hoping it will be different than Jackson Blockbuster Part 4.Brooser Bearhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08487438364129415650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-40972577732015901182011-07-13T09:50:53.661-04:002011-07-13T09:50:53.661-04:00The songs were fabulous. I didn't understand w...The songs were fabulous. I didn't understand why they were in the book until I saw this adaptation.<br /><br />My problem was with the fight scenes; the whirling doom that enemies were sent to detracted from the message of the story: that violence is not glorious.coderodenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12286825037952486234noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-25078272425265422992011-07-13T08:16:58.038-04:002011-07-13T08:16:58.038-04:00"But how really important is it to be able to..."But how really important is it to be able to distinguish one dwarf from any other in The Hobbit anyway?"<br /><br />Exactly. This is the point being missed, IMO. There isn't a real need to distinguish the dwarves from each other. I'd go so far as to say that one of the points made was how similar the dwarves were to each other.jgbrowninghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16274622778419965618noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-61892687907631931992011-07-13T07:31:09.245-04:002011-07-13T07:31:09.245-04:00Personally I didn't like the Rankin/Bass Smaug...Personally I didn't like the Rankin/Bass Smaug. He seems too boorish. I'm hoping the Jackson version will be more suave.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07090296806321882601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-8289504921374100782011-07-13T06:49:36.962-04:002011-07-13T06:49:36.962-04:00My dad bought our first color tv in hopes of getti...My dad bought our first color tv in hopes of getting it before "The Hobbit" aired (it didn't get delivered on time).<br />Sure it's got problems, but Richard Boone is suitably monstrous as Smaug and John Huston's Gandalf would never have failed to figure out the riddle of Moria's gate before Frodo. <br /> <br /> For all the flaws in character race design (the wood elves hurt my brain), the look of the clothing so much better captures the ancient Germanic (Gothic/Frankish/Saxon, etc.) vibe I get from the books than do the designs of Peter Jackson. <br /><br />Jackson's various dwarves look like they stepped off of the pages of the latest WotC tome or the cover of a Forgotten Realms book. They look simply too generically "fantasy". In an effort to look dark or more original they look like too much of everything else.<br /><br />Note - I actually love that Rankin and Bass' dwarves come in matched sets. It's the feeling I always got from their names in the first place.The Wasphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08636805818054637966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-4305843564521702862011-07-13T03:02:47.274-04:002011-07-13T03:02:47.274-04:00Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men? Do...Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men? Dori knows!thekelvingreenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01928260185408072124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-83341453318539203412011-07-13T01:39:56.871-04:002011-07-13T01:39:56.871-04:00@coldstream:
judging by the text that's accom...@coldstream:<br /><br />judging by the text that's accompanied the marketing stills of the dwarves from the new jackson flick, he's actually giving each dwarf a well fleshed-out back story.<br /><br />It's interesting, and suddenly it strikes me that our urge these days is to see the same stories told over and over again with ever more "novel" characters in them.Taketoshihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17876641059472816784noreply@blogger.com