tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post4883657435202120437..comments2024-03-28T15:30:09.903-04:00Comments on GROGNARDIA: The Rhythm of the Old SchoolJames Maliszewskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comBlogger57125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-37869908324803111152009-07-02T12:14:10.823-04:002009-07-02T12:14:10.823-04:00I'm starting a online 4e campaign right now th...I'm starting a online 4e campaign right now that is very wilderness-based. I'm actually trying for a sandbox feel, inspired by Chgowiz's very interesting comments on this.<br /><br />I'm definitely against the "15-minute workday" idea, mainly because I've seen it misused a lot in a crpg-esque way. Get into fight, cast spells until enemies are ash and powder. Rest, rinse, repeat.<br /><br />James, what you're describing isn't really a "15-minute workday". The fact that the PC's are travelling, having encounters and such to get rested up and re-stocked means that you're just adding different types of "work" in the sense of different activities in between pure-combat encounters.<br /><br />I've been trying to consider how to incorporate a degree of resource management (be they health resources, or magical or supply resources) into a 4e game.<br /><br />I think one way to do it is to play enemies and creatures much more dynamically than the standard "encounter" format or dungeon calls for.<br /><br />I've never really understood why, for example, if a couple rooms of orcs get killed, and the party retreats to find a place to rest up, the rest of the orcs don't gear up, find the troll and come looking for them. They better hope they left the dungeon at that point - cause they ain't going to get 8 hours of rest!<br /><br />I'm thinking of using healing surges in 4e to simulate the effects of food, exhaustion, exposure and such. I'm going to house-rule that an 8-hour rest returns 2 healing surges, but to get back to full surges, you need a full-day rest in a SAFE place. I know that sleeping in the forest when I know that the goblins are looking for me would not be condusive to "rest".<br /><br />Also, I'll use skill checks to determine "wilderness survival" - finding food, shelter. Failure or partial success will cost healing surges, as the party gets tired and beaten up. Good resource planning will give them bonuses on their checks.<br /><br />I am finding that 4e isn't very well-adapted to the more hard-core, count-your-arrows style of resource management we see in older versions of d&d. I know that that sort of game doesn't really do it for me, but I think that using the Obsidian variant skill challenges and reducing the return of healing surges will give me an interesting type of wildernessy resource management.<br /><br />After all, making interesting choices is a big part of what makes all games fun. Sounds like we all have different ways of encouraging that in our games, and it's neat to read some of the other ways people are doing things.Jeremy Murphyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17072164588443858336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-70088094875948669402009-06-25T13:14:23.799-04:002009-06-25T13:14:23.799-04:00Rob: Those are all valid points. I still enjoy 4...Rob: Those are all valid points. I still enjoy 4e a lot. Then again, the campaign I play in is very role-playing and plot-heavy, and the combat encounters less common; thus, the entire resource issue is simply not as important.Michellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09989288928313815012noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-5930635064461531212009-06-25T02:46:22.248-04:002009-06-25T02:46:22.248-04:00The post (by Michelle, I believe) about 4e's r...The post (by Michelle, I believe) about 4e's resource management makes an interesting point - there definitely is a certain element of resources present. However, I think it's different enough to bother some people.<br /><br />The first of the two basic resource mechanics in 4e is that a short 5-minute rest recharges your encounter powers and allows you to spend healing surges until you recover all your hit points. The surge mechanic basically means that magical healing (by spell or potion) isn't useful for much of *anything* except "a few more hit points come back during combat instead of right after it ends." Surges at every rest *also* means that characters will (unless they are very overextended or very foolish) enter every fight at full or nearly-full health.<br /><br />This drives me a little bonkers: Not being able to walk into a fight wounded removes a lot of drama and tension. It also seems weird for a character to be beaten on all day and still be able to walk into a fight at the top of his game. You could make the argument he's down some resources from losing healing surges, but in practice when I've run the game, it doesn't much matter. When you can only really use 2 or 3 surges in a single encounter, having 9 out of 12 remaining is not really much of a disadvantage.<br /><br />The other resource mechanic is that characters regain daily powers and all their healing surges at the beginning of every day. This has some even stranger implications that threaten to wreck suspension of disbelief for me. (YMMV, naturally) What it means is that even in a normal recovery absent any healing magic, no injury of any kind (including one that brings you to 0 hp and comes within a hair of killing you) can *ever* last longer than one night. Suspension of disbelief is one thing, but that's so far from the truth, it's almost like you aren't playing a person anymore!<br /><br />But the really big problem with resource management and 4e is that nearly any other form of resource, including just about any gameworld or equipment consideration, has had its impact removed or seriously mitigated. While you still need food and water (assuming the DM enforces that), half the ranged attack powers don't even bother to tell you how much ammo they use up. (This constantly comes up for me with Blinding Barrage, the 1st-level Rogue Daily. The flavor text makes it sound like you would need to throw at least several knives or whatever, but they never even venture a guess how many anywhere in the rules.) Monsters don't really hurt gear anymore. Even the Rust Monster just kind of puts magic swords in timeout until you get them reforged (which requires nothing but a wizard and the dust from the monster's stomach). And my personal favorite: you don't need lanterns anymore, ever, because any wizard can cast Light as often as he wants at no cost.<br /><br />The main resources that you juggle in 4th are both abstract quantities existing only in the rules. But those aren't actual things in the game world, and don't deepen immersion in quite the same way. In-game objects tend to just get swept under the carpet. You could make house rules to fix that, but given the sheer number of modifications that would entail (going through all the ranged attack powers, for one), is it even worth it?<br /><br />4e's not a bad game if you don't care about that stuff, but there are just some parts of the game that 4e can't handle unless you want to spend hours of drudgery revising powers.<br /><br />With the missing resource game back in, though, a 15-minute workday does make sense, especially in an environment where you don't travel around much. Megadungeons and wildernesses take a long time to explore because there's a lot of constant wandering around and searching the area. Cities, or smaller modern dungeons? Of course your workday is short - events consolidate into the couple hours you run errands.<br /><br />Ultimately, I think it comes down to people trying to measure the challenge of two very different encounters - a small encounters met as part of a series, and a large stand-alone battle - by the same flawed yardstick.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10499978899288046380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-40123669751160176742009-06-24T21:02:15.973-04:002009-06-24T21:02:15.973-04:00@asmodean66: I don't like fudging dice rolls, ...@asmodean66: I don't like fudging dice rolls, and it's always been lots of fun for me.<br /><br />But that's the beauty of the game(s), you can play them as you like.<br /><br />Cheers.Jimmy Swillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12549837261062727446noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-80807263062543934102009-06-24T12:14:40.213-04:002009-06-24T12:14:40.213-04:00@Welleran: Thank you for your service.@Welleran: Thank you for your service.Timeshadowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952601433965644275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-74047382946583082322009-06-24T12:04:12.281-04:002009-06-24T12:04:12.281-04:00Resource management is worth including in any edit...Resource management is worth including in any edition of D&D because it creates interesting decisions for the players:<br /><br />Do I use this healing potion now, or save it for the next hit - if I survive it?<br /><br />Do I cast my last fireball on this group of enemies, or hold onto it for when were up against something tougher?<br /><br />Do we risk going on with only one torch, or turn back now and buy some more?<br /><br />Do I waste my last arrows on these goons, or close in with a knife so that I can use them later?<br /><br />...and so on. As has been mentioned earlier, this creates tension. I'd like to add to that by saying it creates interest by forcing the players to make hard choices. <br /><br />To summarise: Hardships can *emerge* out of the resource management that keep the game *interesting*.Pete Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03438651595079082035noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-8384114134603598412009-06-24T10:49:57.219-04:002009-06-24T10:49:57.219-04:00Timeshadows: No, submariner. I only carried a 9M...Timeshadows: No, submariner. I only carried a 9MM and 4 magazines in Iraq which was no burden at all!<br /><br />Regarding resource management and drama, don't forget the reverse situation. That pile of rations left by the evil high priest just slain might be more valauble to a starving party than the gold they also captured. Using mundane items as a "reward" is something I do periodically for a bit of drama. It actually works great if the players are into the game. Magic fountain that the water becomes mundane after taking it away? Sounds like a great source of potable water to me to keep them going. FYI, speaking of water, it will run out MUCH faster than food will.Keith Sloanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07319879076978887933noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-80652994522723232822009-06-24T10:13:06.052-04:002009-06-24T10:13:06.052-04:00I’m also considering a house rule for 4th under wh...<i>I’m also considering a house rule for 4th under which there’s a chance that any character who has been hurt beyond a certain point has sustained a lasting, serious injury, which will impose a penalty until he has a certain number of days’ bed rest.</i><br /><br />I just saw a great system someone developed to represent serious injuries in 4e using the disease track mechanic. This probably doesn't make much sense for people unfamiliar with 4e's disease system. Basically, you would treat a broken leg or other injury just like a disease that takes a long time to heal. It was a very elegant modification of the existing system - I wish I could remember where I saw it - Keith Baker's blog, maybe?<br /><br />Timeshadows - I don't want to get into the fudging rolls discussion, because it's way off topic. I only used it as an example of the way a DM can manipulate the game without the players knowing. If you like to run/play in games in which the party is regularly obliterated by statistical anomilies, the more power to you.<br /><br />More to the point, I see what you're saying about resource management and how a classic-style DM might try to run a game, but I don't think I'd ever want to run a game that way. I see it as bringing trivialities to the forefront of the game. It makes me wonder: do you want to play the supply chain game or the adventure game?<br /><br />I have one other thing that relates back to the original post, and that I find really cool about classic-style games. That is, a random encounter or event can become very big and important to the story. That's very cool when it happens and extremely rewarding for the players and the DM.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-66564483078868499462009-06-24T09:44:57.644-04:002009-06-24T09:44:57.644-04:00[quote] If you want to play superhero and think th...[quote] If you want to play superhero and think that just because you got slashed to ribbons five minutes ago, that shouldn't stop you from engaging in a half dozen more epic fights before bedtime, then stuff like healing surges and encounter powers make perfect sense. These are just different preferences; some like a more gritty, low-powered fantasy rpg, and some like superheros in chainmail.[/quote]<br /><br />Carl: Which is less appealing? That in one edition the PCs are (relatively) fresh and ready to go five minutes later, with serious rest meaning overnight? Or that in another edition it’s going to be at least 3-4 days before they can even consider giving chase without it being pure suicide? For example, say at 4th-6th level in 1E, where it’s going to take quite a few Cure Light Wounds before a beat-up party is even close to healed up? The truth is that no edition of D&D really serves BOTH to provide for realistic delays due to serious injury AND to allow for heroics like we see in movies and books, where the protagonist might be seconds from death one moment, but ready for another deadly battle shortly thereafter. The 3.x editions are probably the closest to a working compromise, with systems allowing both for verisimilitude & cinematic heroics, but at the cost of pretty extensive mechanics, which really bog down at higher levels. And it still doesn’t really allow for both of the above situations.<br /><br />[quote]For my own part, my suspension of disbelief has often been broken the other way. Events which in real life would probably have played out over weeks or months are over in 24 hours of game time, because the PCs are utterly relentless.[/quote]<br /><br />Rafial: Fair point. I have an issue with that too. Personally I’m not totally happy with the rest/healing pace of any D&D edition. Sometimes I’d like to see a PC be laid up with a significant injury. But I’d really like them to have the ability to chase after a bad guy following a nasty fight too. As it stands, no edition really provides for both options. I guess you can get close in earlier editions if the party keeps a substantial stock of healing potions in reserve, but I’m not fond of characters being so dependent on STUFF. <br /><br />I’m also considering a house rule for 4th under which there’s a chance that any character who has been hurt beyond a certain point (maybe unconscious, or brought down under their raw CON score in HP) has sustained a lasting, serious injury, which will impose a penalty until he has a certain number of days’ bed rest. Maybe a movement penalty for a fractured leg, a hit penalty for an arm injury, a penalty to their max HP/total number of surges for a lung/torso wound. Something to ground the action in reality a bit more and encourage them to occasionally take a serious break for rest and recuperation. I’ll probably make it a simple d6 chart, too, in homage to OD&D. <br /><br />[quote]Keeping track of arrows, rounds/mags, or power-cells is the difference between life and death.[/quote]<br /><br />Timeshadows- With this I concur. No matter which edition of the game I’m running, we keep track of this kind of thing. I agree that it’s more realistic to run out when you run out, and that accounting for ammo and light sources is quick and easy enough to not get so boring that you can justify ignoring it. YMMV.<br /><br />Cool discussion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-36458843855616874812009-06-24T09:39:08.914-04:002009-06-24T09:39:08.914-04:00@Welleran: But you already knew that, didn't y...@Welleran: But you already knew that, didn't you? Are you Naval Surface Warfare? SBU?Timeshadowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952601433965644275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-47880111066633179962009-06-24T09:35:10.727-04:002009-06-24T09:35:10.727-04:00@Welleran: Cool, thanks! Next time you're in S...@Welleran: Cool, thanks! Next time you're in South Florida, drop me a line. :)<br /><br />Oh, BTW, 12 30-round magazines is pretty much standard load out for contemporary 'warfighters'.Timeshadowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952601433965644275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-65352798153880495912009-06-24T09:30:21.619-04:002009-06-24T09:30:21.619-04:00This is one of the more... interesting rationaliza...This is one of the more... interesting rationalizations I've seen for this phenomenon.buzzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06243298798049780695noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-64277182531261859412009-06-24T09:30:19.301-04:002009-06-24T09:30:19.301-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Timeshadowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952601433965644275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-91467876952012576402009-06-24T09:28:33.603-04:002009-06-24T09:28:33.603-04:00"I'll give you two scenarios. In the firs..."I'll give you two scenarios. In the first, the DM rolls a die on a random encounter table and it says that rats have eaten all the party's food supplies. In the second, the DM just decides that the party's food has been eaten by rats. When he looks up from behind the screen, he says the same thing either way. "Your food has been eaten by rats. You have nothing to eat." The situation should create dramatic tension, regardless of how you got there." -- asmodean66<br /><br /><br />IMO, a Classic-play style GM wouldn't tell you that the food had been eaten by rats.<br /><br />S/he'd say, "Do you take any special precautions as you camp out in the Dread Foyer of the Mad Mansion?"<br /><br />The players would say what they would say, and that would be that.<br /><br />Then, at the watch in which the rats begin scuttling about, the person on watch would be told,<br />"You see something moving in one of the provisions bags. What do you do?"<br /><br />See the differences?<br />1). The players still get to act<br />2). The provisions aren't all in one bag, so as not to be lost in one single calamitous event -- why? Because each character has their own provisions written down on their individual sheet (or 3x5 card).<br />---<br /><br />"A good DM should also be fudging die rolls here and there to help things go smoothly. To have an utterly random, impartial system requires a computer, not a person." -- asmodean66<br /><br /><br />Why? Why does the GM need to fudge rolls? Didn't these fools go into a hornet's nest looking for trouble?<br />If the encounter 2d4+1 rats, or 2 Bullettes, its an encounter. One doesn't *plan* to bump into a Bullette in a dark alley any more than they *plan* to bump into a small swarm of a dozen rats in the well-patrolled City of Shaledove. It just happens...<br />...like a car accident, or an IED/EFD.<br /><br />'Them's the breaks', as they say.Timeshadowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952601433965644275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-10890365679494132352009-06-24T09:22:24.707-04:002009-06-24T09:22:24.707-04:00asmodean, the example at the beginning of your las...asmodean, the example at the beginning of your last post is unfair. We're not discussing a random table in which one of the examples is rats taking your food. The PCs use the resources; they aren't yanked away by a table. The resource management has to come from the players, not GM fiat.KenHRhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11613789646908929989noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-81778046221032536012009-06-24T09:09:25.734-04:002009-06-24T09:09:25.734-04:00But that isn't real tension then is it? I mean...<i>But that isn't real tension then is it? I mean, I know the GM is just doing it for drama and my character will be just fine.</i><br /><br />I'll give you two scenarios. In the first, the DM rolls a die on a random encounter table and it says that rats have eaten all the party's food supplies. In the second, the DM just decides that the party's food has been eaten by rats. When he looks up from behind the screen, he says the same thing either way. "Your food has been eaten by rats. You have nothing to eat." The situation should create dramatic tension, regardless of how you got there. <br /><br />To say, "I know that the DM is creating this drama and therefore it's irrelevant" is metagaming. It also ignores the larger point, which is that the DM created the entire dungeon and all the encounters. Thus, all the drama in the game springs forth from the DM. A good DM should also be fudging die rolls here and there to help things go smoothly. To have an utterly random, impartial system requires a computer, not a person. <br /><br /><i>Personally I never saw the "15 minute day" before 3e.</i><br /><br />2nd edition had this problem, too. A cleric got 1-2 heals/day at first level and it was all too common for a few bad rolls to put a party in such bad shape that the cleric was out of healing and you could just head home. Also, you always had the wizard with his half-dozen spells that were spent in the first two encounters.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-13290968179590694012009-06-24T08:13:05.786-04:002009-06-24T08:13:05.786-04:00Kudos to Alexander for referencing Clausewitz!
Ku...Kudos to Alexander for referencing Clausewitz!<br /><br />Kudos to Timeshadows for great imagery!<br /><br />I'll play in either of your campaigns anytime! I wonder how many magazines/arrow bundles I can really carry effectively...<br /><br />Actually, my recently-started campaign over Skype with a bunch of my old players has been very gratifying. They have all instinctively embraced the resource management idea from the get-go among other old school styles.<br /><br />Anyone who pays attanetion to military actions knows that solid, sustainable logisitics is often far more important than firepower. The U.S. didn't win WW2 because we consistently outfought the Germans and Japanese - we won because we could flood the entire world with our troops and oodles of material.Keith Sloanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07319879076978887933noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-83601543321645056682009-06-24T05:41:00.979-04:002009-06-24T05:41:00.979-04:00Personally I never saw the "15 minute day&quo...Personally I never saw the "15 minute day" before 3e. Back in the day with 1e, the party usually had the resources to stomp through a very large number of encounters in a day; with Weapon Specialised Fighters/Rangers, Cavaliers and such Unearthed Arcana madness easily trashing the poor monsters.<br /><br />The 15 minute day was an emergent property of 3e's (a) much tougher monsters, (b) Buff spells and (c) abandonment of the 10-minute Turn as the standard measure of time in dungeon exploration.<br /><br />I managed to bring back a 1e ethos in my current 3e game by using old modules & monster stats, and de facto 10 minute Turns. I've sometimes seen 3e-isms like the Raging Barbarian push on into the next encounter, but this kind of behaviour has negative consequences and in extremis I'll even boot the player if they're getting other PCs killed.Simonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01173759805310975320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-13715198540643595132009-06-23T22:20:45.607-04:002009-06-23T22:20:45.607-04:00I concede that the above assumes a non-Plot-driven...I concede that the above assumes a non-Plot-driven game play style, and that isn't the only sort. Yet, it was the topic of the OP.Timeshadowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952601433965644275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-397586650622071902009-06-23T22:18:09.985-04:002009-06-23T22:18:09.985-04:00Back to the military analogy:
If my combat load-o...Back to the military analogy:<br /><br />If my combat load-out is too little, I am not only risking my life, I am risking by partner's as well. The action of him handing me another magazine is not only a force-divisor, but imperils both of us at precisely the moment the perpetrator of violence is looking for; sees the decline in output of firepower, is then emboldened, and the tide changes.<br /><br />This stuff really matters, folks, regardless of whether it is in contemporary setting, or a pseudo-mediaeval one. I know, sure as sh!t that I go over my gear each time before I take my post, and know that until the boys in blue arrive, my partner and I are entirely responsible for our own safety, let alone that of those we've been hired to protect.<br /><br />Keeping track of arrows, rounds/mags, or power-cells is the difference between life and death.Timeshadowshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09952601433965644275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-8426478886104214842009-06-23T21:49:47.373-04:002009-06-23T21:49:47.373-04:00You need to sit down, keep a careful count of each...<i>You need to sit down, keep a careful count of each arrow you use, how many you're able to get back after each battle, how long since you re-filled your lantern, how many flasks of oil you're carrying. Is the dramatic tension created really worth the time you spend doing the paperwork?</i><br /><br />Ah, it can be a species of fun keeping track of that stuff. Players have to consider carefully what they can take along with them, knowing that there are consequences if they mistakenly leave something behind. I get to watch their supplies dwindle, knowing that they're balancing their desire to push ahead with a real possibility of getting stuck in some dismal passage without any food or light. Plus, in the early stages anyway, all that resupplying eats up their funds pretty good. By the time they can afford a mule, it feels like a minor victory.<br /><br />I'm not saying it's for everyone, or for every game, but it's an enjoyable style of play. I actually consider it more fun to keep track of the necessary resources than to level up a 4e character, which I find offers all the enjoyment of manipulating a spreadsheet.TyBannermanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13241483332119936529noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-30571085659090539712009-06-23T21:38:08.840-04:002009-06-23T21:38:08.840-04:00Sure, but they run out of them when the plot dicta...<i>Sure, but they run out of them when the plot dictates. In a roleplaying game, the DM can be the governor of such affairs, using resource shortages when dramatically appropriate to create tension. This allows you to cut out the tedium associated with resource management, but still obtain the dramatic tension.</i><br /><br />But that isn't real tension then is it? I mean, I know the GM is just doing it for drama and my character will be just fine. Personally, I prefer when both the GM and I aren't sure if the PCs are going to make it out alive. I think that's the trade off. Of course, there are many different degrees of resource management and it can be taken too far.Jimmy Swillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12549837261062727446noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-17974274495548949422009-06-23T20:25:45.860-04:002009-06-23T20:25:45.860-04:00plenty of fictional heroes have had to worry about...<i>plenty of fictional heroes have had to worry about running out food, or running out of ammunition.</i><br /><br />Sure, but they run out of them when the plot dictates. In a roleplaying game, the DM can be the governor of such affairs, using resource shortages when dramatically appropriate to create tension. This allows you to cut out the tedium associated with resource management, but still obtain the dramatic tension.<br /><br />The other "problem" with games that are heavy on resource management is that it often feels like you're playing Accountants & Actuaries. You need to sit down, keep a careful count of each arrow you use, how many you're able to get back after each battle, how long since you re-filled your lantern, how many flasks of oil you're carrying. Is the dramatic tension created really worth the time you spend doing the paperwork?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-67796397640126914402009-06-23T20:02:35.203-04:002009-06-23T20:02:35.203-04:00I don't think there has to be an inconsistency...I don't think there has to be an inconsistency between good narrative and resource management.<br /><br />It's true that the Three Musketeers may not have had to worry about supply lines, but plenty of fictional heroes have had to worry about running out food, or running out of ammunition.<br /><br />We had a recent battle where the party faced a wave of undead. They formed a shield wall with the toughest fighters and then the rear echelons hurled holy water - very effective. Because we keep careful track of such things, we knew that each of the six characters had 5 vials. And there was a definite dramatic tension as the supplies dwindled but the undead kept coming. You simply can't get that sort of tension -- the tension that comes from a "culminating point" in a battle, as Clausewitz would describe it -- unless you're paying attention to resource management.Restitutor Orbishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05625086532637410710noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-63290388827564218352009-06-23T19:43:09.377-04:002009-06-23T19:43:09.377-04:00sometimes (in real life and in fiction) events ARE...<i> sometimes (in real life and in fiction) events ARE time-sensitive. Sometimes you need to chase the Orcs who have just raided the town and stolen villagers, or get to the Tower of Zorn before the bad guys do, or track down the Werewolf before he kills again. If the mechanics of the game enforce a pause of multiple DAYS or even weeks) to rest, heal, train, (etc), then you break both narrative flow and suspension of disbelief. </i><br /><br />If anything, not having to pause for a while to heal your wounds or resupply is what would break my suspension of disbelief. If the party is badly wounded and the orcs are making off with half the villagers to their slave pits, it is far more dramatic and heroic for the decision to immediately set out after them be one that might well doom the party to a noble death because they were already weakened and did not have the supplies for an extended chase into the mountains, and conversely stuff like healing surges and encounter powers that make sure a party doesn't blow its wad all at once make it an easy (if unbelievable) decision to instantly set out after those dang orcs! If verisimilitude is what you are after and you don't want to suspend your disbelief screaming from a building by a rubber band, then stuff like stopping to heal and resupply makes perfect sense. If you want to play superhero and think that just because you got slashed to ribbons five minutes ago, that shouldn't stop you from engaging in a half dozen more epic fights before bedtime, then stuff like healing surges and encounter powers make perfect sense. These are just different preferences; some like a more gritty, low-powered fantasy rpg, and some like superheros in chainmail.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07648499022366444265noreply@blogger.com