tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post6681181291271835205..comments2024-03-28T15:30:09.903-04:00Comments on GROGNARDIA: Pulp Fantasy Library: Three Hearts and Three LionsJames Maliszewskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-38483256818621022772021-10-09T23:05:35.274-04:002021-10-09T23:05:35.274-04:00And Naria.And Naria.David Pulverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00857524962421597982noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-82991842357207904602021-10-09T23:04:49.420-04:002021-10-09T23:04:49.420-04:00If I remember correctly, Anderson may have also us...If I remember correctly, Anderson may have also used the Law/Chaos system - at least a bit - in his modern-world with magic book Operation Chaos.David Pulverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00857524962421597982noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-78235947709222359942021-10-09T23:03:13.287-04:002021-10-09T23:03:13.287-04:00I love Three Hearts and Three Lions (I have the fi...I love Three Hearts and Three Lions (I have the first-print hardback, though alas only in Book Club version). Besides the obvious alignment stuff, the troll, etc. I think the way the elves were presented here may have also had some slight influence on the drow, with the "beautiful but villainous elves" trope.<br /><br />However, I think Anderson (and Moorcock)'s influence regarding alignment was ultimately baneful. Take that passage you quote, explaining Law and Chaos. Then substitute the more familiar terms "Good" and "Evil" for each iteration of law or chaos. NOTHING WOULD CHANGE. (It would be left to Moorcock - with his counter-culture sensibilities - to make chaos/law a bit more complex and distinct than this).<br /><br />But ultimately, I think OD&D (and the OSR who ape this part of) simply dropped the ball. The history of D&D alignment and the barrels of ink spilled on the subject would have been so much simpler and more comprehensible if Gary and/or Dave had never read Moorcock or Anderson and had simply said "you can be Good, Evil, or Neutral" and left it at that. And the only thing that would have changed is that people could have understood the damn thing without the need for complex charts and explanations.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Given it's fundamental role in inspiring D&D it's sort of amazing that early era D&D never really went anywhere with the "modern day people reincarnated into a fantasy world" (even though that's now a staple of Japanese anime and light novels...) Especially when Gygax published a couple of scenarios in which the trip went the otherway (D&D to WWII, etc.)<br /><br /><br />David Pulverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00857524962421597982noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-22936168942572072962021-10-08T19:28:12.047-04:002021-10-08T19:28:12.047-04:00One would think!One would think!Etrimynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12412524174369676893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-38725026905164657802021-10-08T16:00:37.347-04:002021-10-08T16:00:37.347-04:00Lots of characters statted in GITE don't fit R...Lots of characters statted in GITE don't fit RAW (though it would have been easier to do with Holger than with most).John Brinegarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12123235797335728124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-17325754570051544582021-10-07T09:14:30.245-04:002021-10-07T09:14:30.245-04:00Hugi and Holger Carlsen are statted in Giants of t...Hugi and Holger Carlsen are statted in Giants of the Earth in Dragon magazine's 49th issue (with the Hildebrandt dragon cover).<br /><br />Interestingly, Holger isn't made with the RAW.<br />Etrimynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12412524174369676893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-72889756076807437392021-10-07T09:10:54.651-04:002021-10-07T09:10:54.651-04:00Two negatives make a positive. :)Two negatives make a positive. :)Etrimynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12412524174369676893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-76756903482323038982021-10-06T07:55:19.044-04:002021-10-06T07:55:19.044-04:00Presumably two "Chaos" factions brawling...Presumably two "Chaos" factions brawling with one another would weaken teh overall cause, same way two mortal human factions fighting does to Law in the HRE v Saracen example. OTOH, Chaos likes disorder, so maybe the opposite is true if it benefits from any warfare, even between its followers?Dick McGeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14521293874696659063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-38675414635600854612021-10-05T15:02:00.124-04:002021-10-05T15:02:00.124-04:00"Wars among men, such as the long-drawn strug..."Wars among men, such as the long-drawn struggle between the Saracens and the Holy Empire, aided Chaos..." Would wars between Faerie and Trollheim benefit Law? Is that why the Aesir have intervened on the side of the Elves in 'The Broken Sword?'Swazihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00269437344151627111noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-82813874871584673192021-10-05T10:17:35.316-04:002021-10-05T10:17:35.316-04:00It's in Three Hearts and Three Lions!It's in Three Hearts and Three Lions! Alanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06184950390585208722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-44884655644317952652021-10-05T08:43:28.461-04:002021-10-05T08:43:28.461-04:00Kids these days would immediately recognize them a...Kids these days would immediately recognize them as isekai stories, although they might wonder why so few protagonists get "sent to another world" through the traditional method of being hit by a truck. <br /><br />Yeah, John Carter is an isekai series. :)Dick McGeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14521293874696659063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-65105173668752225232021-10-05T06:59:30.497-04:002021-10-05T06:59:30.497-04:00I seem to recall that rubbery green regenerating t...I seem to recall that rubbery green regenerating trolls made an appearance in The Broken Sword. At any rate in a Poul Andersen story.Thomas Lindgrenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10529775120938964314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-49157807533414061632021-10-05T02:09:42.668-04:002021-10-05T02:09:42.668-04:00Oh, yes the adventures of Jorian were another book...Oh, yes the adventures of Jorian were another book I read more or less at the same time, and with great enjoyment. I sneak in the Grand Bastard of Othomae in my games whenever I can.artikidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17474295473142339717noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-86561521134726901862021-10-04T23:16:29.470-04:002021-10-04T23:16:29.470-04:00One of my favorite stories of all time, and the so...One of my favorite stories of all time, and the source of my online alias which, until Wheel of Time had ogiers instead of ogres, was usually available. And then, after WoT, I had to go with stuff like ogier300 instead.Jason Langloishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02507550527211520786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-37961550623475426122021-10-04T18:17:16.734-04:002021-10-04T18:17:16.734-04:00Interesting how many Appendix N Protagonists are p...Interesting how many Appendix N Protagonists are people from "modern day" Earth thrown into another world, yet this did NOT transfer over to D&D, excepting the cartoon. <br /><br />Now I'm off to write up a retro clone.....<br />JEFFBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08862106711059104379noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-62291127290257401652021-10-04T12:56:40.486-04:002021-10-04T12:56:40.486-04:00While it looks like 1961 was the first book public...While it looks like 1961 was the first book publication, my copy also lists an earlier (1953) copyright date, presumably for a magazine publication. That's significant because it puts publication of this story prior to Tolkien's Lord of the Rings. Trenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01889179660165006042noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-2013163095773950782021-10-04T11:57:28.318-04:002021-10-04T11:57:28.318-04:00Much as I enjoyed the Harold Shea stories, deCamp&...Much as I enjoyed the Harold Shea stories, deCamp's Novarian books are the most D&D-ish of his works to me. If Clocks of Iraz didn't pre-date the game I'd accuse it of being written from someone's campaign notes. :)Dick McGeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14521293874696659063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-40428212048808466332021-10-04T08:11:31.748-04:002021-10-04T08:11:31.748-04:00Moorcock was also a big fan of the slightly earlie...Moorcock was also a big fan of the slightly earlier Anderson novel The Broken Sword, which he praised as being better than Tolkein and credited with inspiring Elric's Stormbringer.<br /><br />I'm more of a fan of Anderson's scifi (particularly the earlier Polesotechnic League stories and the Hoka comedy stuff he co-authored with Dickson) but he did produce some very interesting fantasy works that are (like all his work) grossly underappreciated these days.<br /><br />SPI produced a boardgame based on his High Crusade novel, which I believe was only sold as a magazine insert in Ares. Quite good, and the mag included a short story addition to the setting that I've never seen reprinted elsewhere.Dick McGeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14521293874696659063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-60139315201571101502021-10-04T07:28:08.049-04:002021-10-04T07:28:08.049-04:00I liked Three Hearts and three lions (and the Brok...I liked Three Hearts and three lions (and the Broken Sword too) quite a lot, and its influence on D&D is undeniable.<br />But in my mind, the novel (with some similarities) that I really equate with D&D gaming is DeCamp's Iron Castle and all the Harold Shea series.<br />The fact that I read the Iron Castle at the time I was getting into gaming, definitely must have had a part in this preference of mineartikidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17474295473142339717noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-47976040513010171732021-10-04T01:42:19.443-04:002021-10-04T01:42:19.443-04:00Holger Carlsen makes a cameo appearance at the Old...Holger Carlsen makes a cameo appearance at the Old Phoenix in A Midsummer Tempest, where he meets with a now grown up Valeria Matuchek from Operation Chaos. Just thought that was worth mentioning. Crouchbackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02633154359317901331noreply@blogger.com