tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post8876397578258257170..comments2024-03-28T01:53:34.870-04:00Comments on GROGNARDIA: Retrospective: Skyrealms of JoruneJames Maliszewskihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-80753396073721644732010-11-19T22:33:24.512-05:002010-11-19T22:33:24.512-05:00I'm trying to update the Jorune Conversions. W...I'm trying to update the Jorune Conversions. What I have so far...<br /><br />FUZION, HERO SYSTEM, MYSTERY SYSTEM, OVER THE EDGE , GURPS, UNISYSTEM, STORYTELLER, PLUS SYSTEM and ORFA (One Roll Fits All). There were noises of conversion to FATE, FUDGE and BURNING WHEEL. Any news on these?<br /><br />Some are complete, some are playtested, some are just notes ... I'd like to get them all into one place.<br /><br />Contact me through joe adams 1950 at g mail dot com.Anonymous Reviewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17344172490154355380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-15697695650195729952010-03-24T12:54:13.066-04:002010-03-24T12:54:13.066-04:00Got here from the Harn post (http://grognardia.blo...Got here from the Harn post (http://grognardia.blogspot.com/2010/03/retrospectve-harn.html).<br /><br />I've never run or played Jorune though I've had and read 2nd and 3rd edition and played the computer game some. The basic premise isn't too difficult really and the art is amazing and really helps the setting come to life. <br /><br />However the use of setting terms as gaming terms in place of standard terminology made it difficult to just get in and play. Also no edition that I've read had rules workable enough to play without essentially re(writing) whole chapters. Perhaps with one of the fan systems.<br /><br />In contrast Tekumel uses standard gaming terms and has both playable published and fan systems. It's also easier to get, though Jorune is technically still in print, as Chessex still sells 3rd edition last time I checked.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-53199822294284667992010-03-16T16:39:54.402-04:002010-03-16T16:39:54.402-04:00"Loved the setting and the art, never did get..."Loved the setting and the art, never did get to play the game. At "BRP Central," a good dedicated to Chaosium's Basid Roleplaying system, there's a person trying to do a BRP conversion for Jorune. I think it's the isho system that's giving him the most trouble."<br /><br />That would be me, and the problem is not Isho, but real life consuming my time. Maybe I will get a chance to get back to it this weekend ...Ianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11892230645337400395noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-88507345722280622102010-03-12T19:13:04.811-05:002010-03-12T19:13:04.811-05:00Speaking of Jorune, we will likely never see anoth...<i>Speaking of Jorune, we will likely never see another Jorune product. I worked for the guy who designed it, and he indicated the IP is hopelessly tangled in an intractable legal mess.</i><br /><br>That's what I remembered reading somewhere. It's a real pity, as I think Jorune is an awesome setting and, if properly presented and with better rules, it could have been much more accessible than it was.<br /><br />Ah well.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-29824489909329839782010-03-12T19:11:23.136-05:002010-03-12T19:11:23.136-05:00I always wondered what was happening in that pictu...<i>I always wondered what was happening in that picture.</i><br /><br>The illustration includes a description in its black and white version but I can't recall what it was. I believe it depicts the death of a famous shantha from the history, but my memory may be faulty.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-38280271089319012122010-03-12T09:14:47.799-05:002010-03-12T09:14:47.799-05:00Played the third edition of Jorune once and ran it...Played the third edition of Jorune once and ran it twice, for a total of about 5 or 6 game sessions...<br /><br />The first problem is teaching players the language, the second is giving up on the game system to go back to playing AD&D.<br /><br />I'm tempted to house-rule Jorune into another system now, maybe Mutant Future or Swords & Wizardry.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-6426969291467506042010-03-11T07:08:38.689-05:002010-03-11T07:08:38.689-05:00In what sense did "The Dragon" "off...<i>In what sense did "The Dragon" "officially" become "Dragon" in issue 24? On the cover it is "The Dragon" until issue 38, and in interior text written by editorial references to "The Dragon" continue for some issues (not sure how many). The first masthead that has "Dragon" instead of "The Dragon" is 42.</i><br /><br>I am in error on this point. I was responding quickly to an earlier comment and didn't bother to check my issues to see when the changeover happened, since it occurred before I started reading the magazine around issue 60-something or other. <br /><br />If anyone is looking for some other point to correct me about, I am sure I've misspelled a few words in my posts here and there too.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-9740916881546107202010-03-11T03:45:15.923-05:002010-03-11T03:45:15.923-05:00Damn this game looks awesome!!! but I'll have ...Damn this game looks awesome!!! but I'll have hard times finding a copy of a 2nd edition...MTNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10389626031147642433noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-84524126128199597982010-03-11T01:33:06.776-05:002010-03-11T01:33:06.776-05:00Doh! That is supposed to say "text written by...Doh! That is supposed to say "text written by editorial staff"James McCannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18071008782847309923noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-45909322441273072692010-03-11T01:31:01.858-05:002010-03-11T01:31:01.858-05:00In what sense did "The Dragon" "off...In what sense did "The Dragon" "officially" become "Dragon" in issue 24? On the cover it is "The Dragon" until issue 38, and in interior text written by editorial references to "The Dragon" continue for some issues (not sure how many). The first masthead that has "Dragon" instead of "The Dragon" is 42.James McCannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18071008782847309923noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-54189148347272497342010-03-10T22:28:25.006-05:002010-03-10T22:28:25.006-05:00This comment has been removed by the author.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-40229746099461713722010-03-10T19:16:41.917-05:002010-03-10T19:16:41.917-05:00Thanks to Sean Wills for pointing out the caption ...Thanks to Sean Wills for pointing out the caption I overlooked. I googled it and found a website by Robert Dushay with the following explanation:<br /><br />"The caption reads "Death scene of Sho Copra-Tra, Sholari of Tashka." This is a complex and important scene to the setting. The aged human is probably the muadra Gends, the first of the muadra trained in isho skills by Sho Copra-Tra himself. A sholari is a priest, and Copra-Tra is another title meaning "master of Tra." The glowing orb between their hands is a naull orb; it is the simplest of isho manifestations, and reveals your personal essence. It is used as a peaceful greeting among muadra. Sho Copra-Tra's naull is almost pure white, the visible portion of tra energy. The huge figure in the back is a corastin. These are simple beings of great strength, who frequently hire themselves out as guards. From their poses, it is likely that the human female and the corastin are servants of Gends."Snebhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03757075638682888854noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-70510917899960962342010-03-10T18:36:24.648-05:002010-03-10T18:36:24.648-05:00Bought it, DMd it, loved the art. I don't reme...Bought it, DMd it, loved the art. I don't remember the skill system at all but I remember combat taking forever - it was a series of challenged skill rolls (d20s???) that took forever to finally complete.<br /><br />Also, like Talislanta, the world was <i>too</i> alien, so unless the players had also bought and read the rules (they hadn't) they were confused and at sea from the moment they started playing.<br /><br />Great idea though!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-70168548304861582092010-03-10T18:02:30.482-05:002010-03-10T18:02:30.482-05:00Good post. I had nearly forgotten about this game,...Good post. I had nearly forgotten about this game, due to the fact that in my area, I never saw it for sale. Anywhere. If not for the Dragon, I would never have known of its existence.Chris#6https://www.blogger.com/profile/08305925037284931371noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-66705746708687067952010-03-10T17:54:58.061-05:002010-03-10T17:54:58.061-05:00Wow - this is freaky. I was actually going to pos...Wow - this is freaky. I was actually going to post a question this week on DF to see if anybody knew what the hell this old Jorune game was! (after not finding any info because I mis-remembered the name as "Journe") Thanks! Yeah, 25 years later I still remembered those weird ads in Dragon.Brooks Rowndhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15446341807546945889noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-20203996922301648562010-03-10T17:11:27.057-05:002010-03-10T17:11:27.057-05:00> buzz said...
> I owned the first two edit...> buzz said...<br />> I owned the first two editions of this game. I never figured out what to do with it<br /><br />(ah; so you were responsible for the other 1e sale *jk*. Beware, you will have collectors on your tail if you still have that ;)irbyzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10193584357850337816noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-43310265320593751982010-03-10T17:07:59.201-05:002010-03-10T17:07:59.201-05:00The first edition ( http://farm3.static.flickr.com...The first edition ( http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2798/4099870964_a97e6e7557_o.jpg ) - which appears to have had abysmally poor sales - is a bit more rough-and-ready in play-style (wilderness/dungeon-crawling D&D in Avatar-land *jk*) and doesn't use that "first EPT adventure" framing device, etc., although there are clearly more backstory similarities there than with MA.<br /><br />> The irony is that, while its rules were clunky, the designers seemed to expect that the game would focus more on "social" conflicts and exploration rather than combat and magical duels<br /><br />Those aspects came more to the fore in 2e although the depth of background and potential for steering such a course is still clearly "bubbling under" in 1e.<br /><br />> By most accounts, Skyrealms of Jorune began its existence as a hack of Metamorphosis Alpha<br /><br />Only if Runequest is a D&D hack, perhaps?<br />There's a difference between system and campaign setting and not so many RPGs were designed from scratch without any previous gaming "baggage" or experience. The Jorune /campaign setting/ evolved from extended gameplay far beyond original-setting MA game playing.<br /><br />> You never played it, of course <br /><br />As used to be said of C&S... ;)<br /><br />Oi! Well, OK we didn't play it for /long/; only tried in passing. :)<br /><br />Thanks for the retrospective, James; and agreed, definitely one that deserves to be continued forward, too, rather than consigned to the past. The setting need not follow the mechanics slavishly, of course.irbyzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10193584357850337816noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-39861730721020217512010-03-10T16:29:34.112-05:002010-03-10T16:29:34.112-05:00Thank you for this post: your analysis really and ...Thank you for this post: your analysis really and truly hit home like a dart to the heart. It is too tempting to develop an overly complex and completely useless self-referential set of overly complicated rules that drive away anyone who might have been interested in the setting in the first place. It's a trap that has snared many along the path, not just the creators of Jorune. The setting can be as exotic as all get out, but in the end the rules used to explore it need to be accessible and flexible enough to allow people to actually play within the setting, otherwise it becomes an exercise in authorial-tyranny, canonical-arguing, and pretentious posturing that was boring and old before it even hit the page or monitor.<br /><br />Like I said, you've given me, personally, some food for thought in a most timely manner, and I thank you for it.<br /><br />Looks like it is time to go back to the roots all over again. Cool.netherwerkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08361800925618339097noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-2986258416077671062010-03-10T16:22:27.789-05:002010-03-10T16:22:27.789-05:00Always saw the ads, never came across the game. Th...Always saw the ads, never came across the game. The first & second groups I ran with really preferred a mix of combat with some political intrigue. I doubt the game would have gotten much play even if I had come across it. I did manage to play Man, Myth & Magic for a while. After Dragonquest, Gamma World probably got the most play, then Star Frontiers. There were a host of other very specific genre games, but none had the staying power of a fantasy setting.Padrehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05722958681098483324noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-55770328972571687522010-03-10T16:21:42.150-05:002010-03-10T16:21:42.150-05:00I owned the first two editions of this game. I nev...I owned the first two editions of this game. I never figured out what to do with it, but I will add to the chorus that the second edition had some of the best, most evocative art I've ever seen in an RPG. I'd love to see a new edition, perhaps even as a setting book for some other RPG.buzzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06243298798049780695noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-22701892960477910652010-03-10T16:18:10.860-05:002010-03-10T16:18:10.860-05:00Speaking of Jorune, we will likely never see anoth...Speaking of Jorune, we will likely never see another Jorune product. I worked for the guy who designed it, and he indicated the IP is hopelessly tangled in an intractable legal mess.<br /><br />I always had an interest in it from those Dragon ads, and never even saw a copy until I was much older. The artist, Miles Teves, is one of the top Hollywood concept artists now: milesteves.comThomas Denmarkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06135075012362548876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-36181008602714090142010-03-10T16:16:11.855-05:002010-03-10T16:16:11.855-05:00I bought this game (and it's supplements) when...I bought this game (and it's supplements) when they were originally released. I treasure them. Quite frankly some of the most beautiful artwork I have ever seen in any RPG ever published. I have no memory of the rules at all. I haven't looked at it in years. Sounds like I should. This is just such a wonderful gaming product.Tetsubohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00339621610619347842noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-86600456409938836622010-03-10T15:49:56.160-05:002010-03-10T15:49:56.160-05:00I still own a copy of this game.
It had a great w...I still own a copy of this game.<br /><br />It had a great world and story. <br /><br />However, its rules are horrendous. To call this game in line with "Silver Age sensibilities" is slander a lot of really well-designed rule systems (But then I am on record as preferring the late 80s Silver Age over the inconsistent game design of the Golden Age). <br /><br />Combat, in particular, is horrendously complex and Loremaster-level fatal. So you are supposed to focus on skills. And these suffer from the classic problems that plagued the early skill system; the designer tries to be complete and "realistic", but the skill selection just appears to be random.Walkerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14039652384328042542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-84004263615444086142010-03-10T15:15:53.064-05:002010-03-10T15:15:53.064-05:00Bought it, planned a campaign, made characters, ne...Bought it, planned a campaign, made characters, never actually played.<br /><br />I remember when I realized, "Hey, there's not really any magic in this world!", in the sense of arcanery. Isho is really more like psionics, if I remember correctly.<br /><br />The art, though, that's what sold me...kesherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17494262159858200847noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7487871339000666216.post-62804945138138380902010-03-10T14:48:04.917-05:002010-03-10T14:48:04.917-05:00I'm afraid I have to ask you to turn in your O...<i>I'm afraid I have to ask you to turn in your Old School credentials. The magazine was "The Dragon", not "Dragon".</i><br /><br>It was <i>The Dragon</i> only for the first 23 issues, but officially became <i>Dragon</i> (without the definite article) in issue 24.James Maliszewskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00341941102398271464noreply@blogger.com